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Author Topic: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1  (Read 175790 times)

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September 27, 2014, 03:55:57 PMReply #100

Offline Lord Xizer

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #100 on: September 27, 2014, 03:55:57 PM »
Thats a really good combo fleet
"I do not intend to be the Emperor's servant forever..."-High Inquisitor Jerec

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September 27, 2014, 04:36:48 PMReply #101

Offline tlmiller

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #101 on: September 27, 2014, 04:36:48 PM »
Not sure what buff you gave the Tie/D Defender, but it's massively OP.  4 Tie Hunters + 3 Tie/Ln with a level 1 speed boost were destroyed by a SINGLE Tie/D Squadron.  Insanely OP'd considering the Hunter is just a very minor amount weaker than the Defender by itself, 4 Squadrons should reap a Defender squadron mercilessly.

I'm not a huge fan of either Praetor II or Tector to be honest, but I was requested to give the Alignment Tectors (or was it for EotH? lol) so that's one of the reasons they are there.

If you don't mind playing as the NR, I would suggest the NR Orinda Campaign GC. Last time I checked, the AI Remnant loves building Lancer-Tector-Venator fleets in Era 4, which are an absolute nightmare for NR to deal with.

That's actually the fleet I said makes the Tector worthwhile.  :)
« Last Edit: September 27, 2014, 04:39:12 PM by tlmiller »
People should not be afraid of their government...governments should be afraid of their people.

September 27, 2014, 06:02:47 PMReply #102

Offline Vulcanus

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #102 on: September 27, 2014, 06:02:47 PM »
Not sure what buff you gave the Tie/D Defender, but it's massively OP.  4 Tie Hunters + 3 Tie/Ln with a level 1 speed boost were destroyed by a SINGLE Tie/D Squadron.  Insanely OP'd considering the Hunter is just a very minor amount weaker than the Defender by itself, 4 Squadrons should reap a Defender squadron mercilessly.

TIE Defender stat comparison:
Original: 1 slow rate-of-fire laser cannon, 2 inaccurate medium ion cannons, 30 concussion missiles

New: 4 dual-linked heavy laser cannons, 2 dual-linked medium ion cannons, 4 proton torpedoes , 4 concussion missiles

Maarek Stele 181st variant: 6 dual linked laser cannons, 8 proton torpedoes

I tested the new TIE Defender dozens of times against various opposition. It is no longer the missile assault platform it used to be, but more of a sophisticated air-dominance fighter with a limited amount of ordnance. In one-on-one combat it will utterly destroy squadron after squadron of bottom-barrel weaker fighters. The trick is, with very limited number of missiles it can't penetrate the shields of heavier fighters like X-Wings or Clawcraft. Try matching a squadron of Defenders against 2-3 X-Wing squadrons and the Defenders will get humiliated. The problem with TIE/Ln and TIE Hunter is that they both have weak hull, so they get destroyed by TIE Defender's heavy laser cannons and they lack the firepower to punch through its shields. Just a horrible stylistical match-up. I haven't done anything with TIE Hunters, so they suffer from the same problem as the original TIE Defenders in that their ion cannons are horribly inaccurate and they have only one slow rate-of-fire laser cannon.

Balancing the fighters so that they match up properly in head-to-head and 2-on-1 and 3-on-1 situations is a very time-consuming process, but only the TIE Hunter and the Trifoil have been left out of it. Not sure if I want to do anything to either of those except maybe changing Hunter's ion cannons to dual-linked. IIRC the Thrawn's Revenge team wanted to make the Hunters weaker than in universe to justify having them in large numbers for PA, and I like them as they are: super-fancy TIEs with little actual bark. Giving PA elite interceptor fighters in large numbers combined with their Venators and Skiprays would make them horribly OP in comparison to even the NR fighters.


The rest of the fighters are balanced more or less this way, may have forgotten some:

XJ X-Wings and Scarsiss are better than the rest. Furions maintain their missiles, but are significantly less manouverable, making them third-tier in h2h but still devastating from the distance.

A-Wing (higher intensity lasers, longer loading time), X-Wing (dual linked lasers), TIE Interceptor (higher intensity lasers, longer loading time) and the Clawcraft (slower; stronger shields and hull) are 100% equal in h2h, as in its 50-50 who wins. they are also almost equal in power against multiple TIE/Ln squadrons, but have highly varying performance vs. many second-tier fighters.

Howlrunners (stronger hull and shields, since higher agility has close to zero impact to performance), TIE Raptors (fewer missiles) and Preybirds (fewer missiles, other changes?) are somewhat equal.

TIE Droids (way worse agility, stronger hull?), Krsiss Interceptors (reduced number of pulses and agility) and TIE Hunters are somewhat equal.

TIE/Ln still sucks.

That's actually the fleet I said makes the Tector worthwhile.  :)

Arguably the most terrifying fleet you can face as the NR.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2014, 06:04:55 PM by Vulcanus »

September 28, 2014, 07:34:41 AMReply #103

Offline Pali

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #103 on: September 28, 2014, 07:34:41 AM »
At week 54 of a PA ICW campaign on Admiral, and I am really, REALLY liking the PA recruitment system you've implemented.  I've mostly expanded east, having taken the CSA, Dathomir, and Mon Calamari, while also pushing south a bit giving me a defensive line of Bilbringi-Ord Mantell-Levian Two.  I've got four main fleets at the moment, and it is really cool how their composition naturally varies - Bilbringi's full of ISD2s and VSD2s, Ord Mantell and Levian Two are Praetor, Venator and Munificent heavy, while the fleet that just took Mon Cal is full of Vic1s and Lucrehulks.  I have no idea what the situation in the core looks like, though I suspect the IR is winning, given the fleets I had to recently fight off and the NR's weakness in the Mon Cal region.

September 30, 2014, 03:23:05 AMReply #104

Offline Pali

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #104 on: September 30, 2014, 03:23:05 AM »
Hm... just realized that I can't recruit Strang from Dathomir.  Any way I can fix that?

September 30, 2014, 06:25:49 AMReply #105

Offline Vulcanus

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #105 on: September 30, 2014, 06:25:49 AM »
Hm... just realized that I can't recruit Strang from Dathomir.  Any way I can fix that?

https://mega.co.nz/#!xtsSCSZB!tdR7IYYTPE5HmdtXQyFvIYHnzK2bQHNBJ4IvvZ56yaU

Fixed Pentastar_Heroes, drop it in the XML folder.

September 30, 2014, 01:30:37 PMReply #106

Offline Lord Xizer

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #106 on: September 30, 2014, 01:30:37 PM »
Gotta just say again how well done this sub mod is. The GCs are great, challenging and the replay value is awesome.  Love it and looking forward to future installments
"I do not intend to be the Emperor's servant forever..."-High Inquisitor Jerec

"The New Order has never fallen. Only the Emperor."-Grand Moff Ardus Kaine

September 30, 2014, 01:43:23 PMReply #107

Offline tlmiller

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #107 on: September 30, 2014, 01:43:23 PM »
IMO, the only major change needed is that the recruitable heroes, if you get one killed, are re-recruitable.  They should have the lifetime build limit of 1, so that they can't be re-recruited once they die.
People should not be afraid of their government...governments should be afraid of their people.

September 30, 2014, 07:17:13 PMReply #108

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #108 on: September 30, 2014, 07:17:13 PM »
IMO, the only major change needed is that the recruitable heroes, if you get one killed, are re-recruitable.  They should have the lifetime build limit of 1, so that they can't be re-recruited once they die.

Huh, I hadn't noticed that
"I do not intend to be the Emperor's servant forever..."-High Inquisitor Jerec

"The New Order has never fallen. Only the Emperor."-Grand Moff Ardus Kaine

September 30, 2014, 08:00:30 PMReply #109

Offline Revanchist

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #109 on: September 30, 2014, 08:00:30 PM »
Also, it would be interesting if you had a cap of total heroes for the PA as well, so the player has to choose which to build and if he should sacrifice one to open up a slot. Not sure if this can be done though.
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September 30, 2014, 08:22:18 PMReply #110

Offline Pali

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #110 on: September 30, 2014, 08:22:18 PM »
Also, it would be interesting if you had a cap of total heroes for the PA as well, so the player has to choose which to build and if he should sacrifice one to open up a slot. Not sure if this can be done though.

Can't say I like this idea, to be honest.  The PA's already got few enough heroes that the added ones don't overwhelm, and the need to take territory to get them already somewhat limits how many you have while making them a nice expansion reward.

Vulcanus, thanks, you rock.  I've pushed into the Core now, and so far all the other heroes seem to be working just fine, though I did notice that the Vengeances buildable at Kuat are still 15 pop (if fixed in the file you just posted above, ignore).
« Last Edit: September 30, 2014, 08:24:12 PM by Pali »

October 01, 2014, 01:08:34 AMReply #111

Offline tlmiller

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #111 on: October 01, 2014, 01:08:34 AM »
Huh, I hadn't noticed that

I threw a few of the recruitable heroes into a battle that they couldn't possibly win to see if them dying caused any issues.
People should not be afraid of their government...governments should be afraid of their people.

October 01, 2014, 01:16:09 AMReply #112

Offline Pali

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #112 on: October 01, 2014, 01:16:09 AM »
Hmm... still can't recruit Strang at Dathomir.  Tried starting a new game and rushing Dathomir to see if that made any difference, but it didn't (both ICW GCs if that's relevant).  Also, Vengeance is still at 15 pop (both Jerec and buildables, though Jerec I can fix on my own - tried finding the buildables, but I'm far from XML-fluent).

I do know that the TIE Adv. X-1 squad dying didn't allow me to re-recruit them though.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2014, 01:40:55 AM by Pali »

October 01, 2014, 10:26:02 AMReply #113

Offline Vulcanus

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #113 on: October 01, 2014, 10:26:02 AM »
Thank you for the feedback, everyone  :).

Regarding Pentastar heroes: They shouldn't be re-recruitable. I flipped through the heroes file and all of them seemingly have the appropriate build limits. Does it apply to all of them?

Found the reason for Strang not being available. He doesn't have an affiliation as a result of some mix-ups with the Providence code.

I'll test those Pentastar heroes, and probably post an update later together with some Greater Maldrood ground combat bug fixes.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2014, 10:32:23 AM by Vulcanus »

October 01, 2014, 02:15:53 PMReply #114

Offline tlmiller

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #114 on: October 01, 2014, 02:15:53 PM »
I know it was the ISD-II and one of the 2 fighter heroes were both recuitable again after I sent them to their doom.
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October 01, 2014, 07:06:39 PMReply #115

Offline Vulcanus

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #115 on: October 01, 2014, 07:06:39 PM »
New 3.1 patch released!

https://mega.co.nz/#!owEXmbSB!W3FEmlU_w0hlpdli3BxFgERYkqkJRCmWlsLO-jKU1h0

This patch fixes the most pressing issues with the 3.0 release.

- Pentastar hero recruitment fixed. Victor Strang and his Storm Commando Saboteurs are now available.

- Improved Greater Maldrood ground combat.

- Pentastar Assassin corvettes removed.

- Added 5 Crimson Vic IIs for the Greater Maldrood's Zsinj Campaign.

- Fixed population cost and fighter complement for the Vengeance-class and NR Lusankya.

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This is a full install, no previous version required.
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This mod is a custom modification and was neither created nor is it supported by the Thrawn's Revenge team. The Thrawn's Revenge team is not responsible for any negative effects from installing these files nor can they be held responsible for fixing any issues which arise from them.
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October 01, 2014, 07:14:29 PMReply #116

Offline Pali

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #116 on: October 01, 2014, 07:14:29 PM »
Awesome, thanks. :)

October 01, 2014, 09:15:00 PMReply #117

Offline tlmiller

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #117 on: October 01, 2014, 09:15:00 PM »
Will have to try it out!!
People should not be afraid of their government...governments should be afraid of their people.

October 02, 2014, 01:03:50 AMReply #118

Offline Pali

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #118 on: October 02, 2014, 01:03:50 AM »
Drats, doesn't work with my saved game. :( Ah well.  New game to start next weekend, it seems. ;)

October 02, 2014, 09:56:36 AMReply #119

Offline Lord Xizer

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Re: Balance & Flavor submod for Imperial Civil War 2.1
« Reply #119 on: October 02, 2014, 09:56:36 AM »
Let it begin!
"I do not intend to be the Emperor's servant forever..."-High Inquisitor Jerec

"The New Order has never fallen. Only the Emperor."-Grand Moff Ardus Kaine

 

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