NR Scout and possible Cruiser add

[A.J.]

So firstly, I just want to say that I love this mod. I've been playing as the NR mainly, and I don't know if it's just me, but I've been having standard in-system ships outrun my scouts. So just a suggestion to either give the scouts a speed boost if that's not already in the works, or to just make the scouts more scout-like. Maybe the sensor pod ability could come back? Also, just because it's my favorite Cruiser, I think you guys should incorporate the Assault Frigate Mk II. But that's just a wish. Continuing to explore, and just want to say you guys have done amazing work!

[Pali]

Problem with the Mk 2 is that it is nearly identical stat-wise to the Mk 1, at best slightly trading some maneuverability for extra shield power.  It wouldn't really add anything to the NR's lineup.  Plus I think it's ugly.

[tlmiller]

And it was less commonly used than the MK1.  2 ships filling the same role, 1 being common and one being uncommon, I imagine the team would always choose to use the common of the 2 unless there was a really good reason not to (I also happen to think the MK 1 is gorgeous compared to the MK2).

[A.J.]

Well, on appearances, I definitely have to disagree. I think the Mk II is what a real Cruiser looks like. :-D That was just mainly wishful thinking. But I always saw those two as the Mk I being an anti-starfighter/anti-frigate type ship. Whereas the Mk II was meant for Cruiser to Cruiser fighting, and able to take on capitals as well. But that's just been my take. Though maybe in place of that, the Majestic-class Cruiser. From the Mon-Cal. That is a very pretty ship to me.

And just as a side note, warheads don't seem to have much of a damage rating. I always figured they would be a bit more prevalent.

[kucsidave]

I have to agree with tlmiller on this one. I wouldn't say that the Mk II is ugly, but it would be a real pain in the back to make a good model of it. There is almost no flat surface on it's hull, which I never really liked. That's my main problem with the flying fishtanks too(Calamari cruisers)
But the main thing is that Mk II were rare compared to the MK Is. This is the main thing that decides it for me.

[A.J.]

I hear ya there. Though I will say I've seen a pretty good model on another mod, but I didn't like that one as much as this one. I'd say that's what I like about it is the smoother contours, yet tons of weaponry. I was a huge fan of the Mk I until I found out she was pretty much all laser cannons, vice turbolasers. I will admit I like that though, flying fish tanks. Ha ha ha, that's a good one

[Pali]

Mk II is also lots of lasers, few turbos.  Wookiepedia lists the two models as having the exact same weapons roster: 15 lasers, 20 quad lasers, 15 turbos.

[A.J.]

They must have changed it lately then. That's where I check ship stats usually as well, and they had the Mk II with quad turbos and the Mk I with quad lasers. I just went and looked again, and now it's the other way around, to my dismay. Ha ha, I'm still a bigger fan of the Mk II though. But not as much, because I like a cruiser cruiser. A heavily armed ship that's still fairly maneuverable, and smaller.

[Pali]

20 quad turbos would have the Mark 2 being stronger than a Victory SD.  I'd bet that was a typo at some point that got fixed.

[A.J.]

That's actually what's listed for the Mk I on there. I went and looked it up earlier because I remember seeing something like that before.

[Vulcanus]

I wouldn't place much stock on the type and number of weapons listed for any ship on the Wook as it is not a primary source but rather a bunch of fanboys bickering about their personal preferences. Many ships have had several different weapon configurations listed for them in different sources over the years. Wook tends to use the most recent one, though that doesn't necessarily make it any better than earlier accounts. And sources are sometimes misunderstood, for example the TIE Bomber on the Wook is stated to have twice the warhead load it is actually given in the original source.

Recently FFG has been updating a number of previously undergunned MonCal ships to have much heavier weapons.

And I personally don't really care how many weapon emplacements a single ship has, since it's the power output that counts IMO.

As for the Assault Frigates, in the few written sources about the Mk.II it is described as a light, fast, MonCal shielded ship, whereas in their first appearance in the Raid on Obroa-Skai four Assault Frigate Mk.I:s together with their fighter complements have Pellaeon with the Chimaera resigned to retreat. And in the Battle of Bilbringi "The two Rebel Assault Frigates broke to either side of the beleaguered Golan II, delivering massive broadsides as they veered off." So if anything, it is the Mk.I that is the brawler of the two, charging headfirst against an ISD II and getting up close and personal with a Golan II.

[Pali]

Good points there, Vulcanus.  The Mk 1's shape also seems more conducive to a fast brawler - slim forward profile making it hard to hit on approach, but a relatively huge pair of side facings would allow a lot of broadside power.  I tend to see it as a ship that slips in, gets off a heavy punch in passing, then gets out before it takes one back - pretty much exactly as that firing run on the Golan has them performing.

Edit: also, the Mk 1 is closer to the original Dreadnaughts in design still, and that was very much a ship-to-ship brawler.

[tlmiller]

Yeah, the MK1 kept almost all the Dreadnaughts weapons, just lost a lot of weight making her far more maneuverable, gained some shields, lost a LOT of crew requirement, and because of the increased draw on her power plant, lost some rate of fire from her weapons. 

[A.J.]

Where would be a good place to go for sources on ships/ship power then? I tend to use Wook quite a bit to compare ships. And if that's the case, maybe the Mk I could be upgraded to be more of a fast brawler. I mean, that's another thing, I'm a huge fan of the Dreadnaught, both Victory SDs, and the Vindicator. Let's just say I use the boarding party ability a ton. Hearing all this is definitely enlightening about the Mk I, and I'm becoming a bigger fan of it, now my suggestion would be to up the ante on it, instead of it being an anti-starfighter/anti-frigate ship.

[Vulcanus]

Where would be a good place to go for sources on ships/ship power then? I tend to use Wook quite a bit to compare ships. And if that's the case, maybe the Mk I could be upgraded to be more of a fast brawler. I mean, that's another thing, I'm a huge fan of the Dreadnaught, both Victory SDs, and the Vindicator. Let's just say I use the boarding party ability a ton. Hearing all this is definitely enlightening about the Mk I, and I'm becoming a bigger fan of it, now my suggestion would be to up the ante on it, instead of it being an anti-starfighter/anti-frigate ship.

It's perfectly fine to use Wook, most of us do, as long as you stay critical and keep in mind that it's the sources that count. And of course, now that most sources are legends you can pick and choose what you want to fit your personal canon. I tend to value how a ship's abilities were thought to be by the author that designed them and/or how they appear in the movies/novels the first time we see them. For example, the K-Wing never had turreted lasers when it first appeared and I'm fine with that since I prefer it as an Early Cold War nuclear bomber-type that relies on outflying enemy interceptors on its way to hit the target. Similarly most later sources keep telling us about how the Y-Wing is slow and rugged, yet that doesn't match their original design as a bomber stripped-down to maximise speed or their performance in the movies (in ANH Y-Wings are not rugged but fragile, in RotJ we see Y-Wings casually vaping TIEs and then flying inside the DSII superstructure alongside A- and X-Wings, chased by TIE Interceptors)

[Pali]

For comparisons of fighter performance, I tend to look to the X-Wing games series myself.  Sure, in the movies you see Y-Wings die in one hit, but EVERY fighter in the movies dies in one hit unless Luke is flying it.

[tlmiller]

For comparisons of fighter performance, I tend to look to the X-Wing games series myself.  Sure, in the movies you see Y-Wings die in one hit, but EVERY fighter in the movies dies in one hit unless Luke is flying it.

I always loved X-Wing Alliance for fighter comparisons.  Seemed to follow how they're described very well (plus had a lot), and improved on the engine of the earlier games.

[Pali]

Agreed.  It also had a huge roster, including lots of fighters only mentioned once or twice - cloakshapes, preybirds, etc.

[tlmiller]

First time I ever flew a blastboat was that game.  Instant love.

[A.J.]

X-Wing Alliance? I don't recognize that. I know of course of the X-Wing and TIE Fighter games. Those were two of my first games, and I loved them. I hated the Neb-B frigates in that game, they were tough!