Thrawn's Revenge
Off Topic => Star Wars Discussion => Topic started by: aNaRcHiSt44 on March 12, 2008, 10:48:14 PM
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Hmmm...Asajj Ventress returning, now that is interesting.
I wonder when we'll have Silri appear with that carbonite army from FoC.. :-\
Ah Slornie? Petroglyph made the story for FoC up-it's fictional inside the Star Wars universe-Tyber Zann would have been mentioned SOMEWHERE if he was indeed as powerful and rich as the game says he is, and therefore SIlri is non-existant as well. It doesnt make sense that he, a criminal master-mind that has a smaller group than the Black Sun could actually challenge the Empire and the Rebellion, because if Black Sun was bigger and Consortium did as stated above, then why the hell would Prince Xizor not be attempting to actually fight them? He does not have the man-power to match either forces, and he would get obliterated by his own troops for even considering fighting the two. And then again, it would just waste all of the time Xizor has spent with the Emperor. Im not personally attacking you, im just merely commenting on the stupidity of Petroglyph-they really should have actually used a storyline that wasnt fictional.
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Everybody knows that Zann is just a game thing.
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they sure as hell set foc up to make a sequal didn't they.
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seems so. but I would like the sequel to be more focused on rebels and impeials. Or maybe the YV invasion. that would be nice too. Or maybe Clone Wars. And Thrawn's doings in the UR. you know pacifying and liberating and conguering planets.
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they do need a prequal. i think making them for the yv wars would be better though since thats following the time line. maybe a clone wars prequal could be added as like a bonus thing not an actual time line. like empire at war the clone wars or something.
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If they did another game, i would expect to see the Clone Wars. Basing the games on the films is the safest bet, since most gamers will be able to relate to the story of the film, whereas far fewer people would be able to understand games based on the Expanded Universe.
Ah Slornie? Petroglyph made the story for FoC up-it's fictional inside the Star Wars universe-Tyber Zann would have been mentioned SOMEWHERE if he was indeed as powerful and rich as the game says he is, and therefore SIlri is non-existant as well.
Actually, FoC is canon, the storylines of Star Wars games are considered "C-canon" (alongside most of the novels, comics, and cartoons). This means that the events and characters from FoC are now shoehorned into canon, and are considered as "canonical" as the Thrawn trilogy, and the Vong War. Im not arguing against you on how unlikely and improbable it is, but that is how things stand.
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they made the whole thing as unsubtle as it was supposed to be though. tyber ran a criminal orginization, not an army like what we would think of.
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Well, you wouldnt consider the Rebel Alliance taking on the might of the Empire and winning as particularly feasible, but it happened.
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very true. although the empire was kind of like the third riech. as soon as the leader died, the whole damn thing fell apart at the seems.
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I hate how because Petrolgyph made up some bullsh*t it is now considered canon, and many people believe that a criminal organisation that didnt even exist up to that point is bigger than the Black Sun. It also doesnt make sense that a group of mercenaries with outdated tech can actually best the Empire, let alone the Rebellion. Seriously, Petroglyph is on thin ice here, and so is FoC.
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I hate how because Petrolgyph made up some bullsh*t it is now considered canon, and many people believe that a criminal organisation that didnt even exist up to that point is bigger than the Black Sun. It also doesnt make sense that a group of mercenaries with outdated tech can actually best the Empire, let alone the Rebellion. Seriously, Petroglyph is on thin ice here, and so is FoC.
Its no worse than a lot of other parts of canon.
While i agree, they didnt do the best job, and probably should have just stuck with Black Sun, there is nothing that can be done about it now - FoC, Zann and his Consortium are all canon.
And, it doesnt make sense that a small ragtag bunch of rebels can take on the Empire, destroy two huge planet-busting superweapons, and go on to liberate the galaxy, yet you are willing to accept it.
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With the Rebellion, for one, they were INCREDIBLY lucky, they were very organised and intelligent, they stole the best fighter designs the Empire had before they could use them, they ahd the back-up of most of the worlds-if only indirectly, they had the full support of the Mon Calamari Shipyards which produced much better ships than the other shipyards, even Kuat Drive Yards. The Rebellion destroyed the Death Star because Tarkin underestimated them and only deployed a few squadrons of Tie's, and Luke was incredibly lucky with that shot. The Rebellion destroyed the second Death Star because they had that huge fleet with them, and because they got lucky AGAIN and destroyed the Death Star AND The Executor. It's a thing with the EMpire; without proper leadership, they retreat, which is what happenned.
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With the Rebellion, for one, they were INCREDIBLY lucky, they were very organised and intelligent, they stole the best fighter designs the Empire had before they could use them, they ahd the back-up of most of the worlds-if only indirectly, they had the full support of the Mon Calamari Shipyards which produced much better ships than the other shipyards, even Kuat Drive Yards. The Rebellion destroyed the Death Star because Tarkin underestimated them and only deployed a few squadrons of Tie's, and Luke was incredibly lucky with that shot. The Rebellion destroyed the second Death Star because they had that huge fleet with them, and because they got lucky AGAIN and destroyed the Death Star AND The Executor. It's a thing with the EMpire; without proper leadership, they retreat, which is what happenned.
So, the Rebel Alliance won mainly because of luck (*Cough* plot device). Zann is alleged to have an incredibly able mind (to the extent that he can pretty much match Thrawn), therefore it is entirely possible for him to fight. Also, the underworld is enormous, there was Black Sun, Jabba, Karrde, and numerous other operations across the galaxy - There is nothing to prevent the Consortium from becoming a major player (and i dont recall it being mentioned as bigger than Black Sun).
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No, it got lucky in the two most major battles. ::)
I know Zann is suppossed to be extremely intelligent, and if he is a match for Thrawn, then perhaps it makes sense that he is such a powerful criminal, but not on that scale. If the Consortium was as major as the game suggested, then it would have been mentioned, wouldnt it? I never said it was bigger than Black Sun, but the game suggests that it is, which is pure sophistry. And also, the Consortium could not win against the EMpire or Rebellion-as I said, and the game also says it, they have outdated ships and vehicles for the most part, and even then the new ones provided by Mandalore are not a match for Mon Calamari Ships or Kuat ships, and they had much larger shipyards anyway. Plus, the Consortium doesnt even have anywhere near as much manpower as the Empire or Rebellion.
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New factions, characters, etc are always being added to the Star Wars universe. It is quite possible for the Zann Consortium to have existed at that size - Unless they specifically identified themselves as belonging to the Consortium, units could be mistaken for any of the other organisations in the underworld. They may even have used dummy corporations, factions to hide their true size/strength. Remember Karrde, he had one of the larger (and better) organisations during the GCW, but very few knew of its true size and influence.
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I guess I didn't think of that, but still, I doubt that the Consortium was that big. I know they keep adding stuff, but next time they do, they should make sure it actually co-incedes with the rest of the universe and doesnt change stuff around that it really shouldn't have even gone anywhere near (think the Eclipse, that Executor in the last mission, and of course-the 'subjugation' of mandalore, etc). If you want my opinion, LucasArts shouldnt allow companies outside it's own to amke up stuff for it-Petroglyph had no idea what thye were going on about, and now they have botched the Star Wars universe. Silri was never emntioned as a Sith, but obviously if she controls that Sith army she now has to become a prominent force to match even Jacen, and that pisses me off. Damm you Petroglyph! You could've just set in motion the complete destruction of a good storyline for the latest book series with your incompetence and lack of attention to what exists in Star Wars!
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a criminal organiztion shouldn't have access to that much firepower.
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Yeah-that's also what makes no sense about the game-the list just keeps getting longer; poor Petroglyph. ;)
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they should expand the timeline canon not make stuff up in the already printed canon that will confuse people.
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Yeah, but it's been a long time since FoC was released, so I doubt they will ever make another expansion, though I hope SOME company with some hint of intelligence that actually keeps to the canon craeets a second EAW, and a good one at that, and it had better be multi-era, or I am gonna puke. They focus too much on the area displayed in the movies, sure they've done some for the NJO and KotOR eras, but they need to put more into those timelines for it to be successful-Star Wars fans are getting sick of repetitive games all concerning the Clone Wars and the GCW.
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i think they are making another game.
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Really? It doenst say anything on IGN or GameSpot or their website.....where did you get that information? It sounds interesting....
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there are worse bits of canon. like chewie's death.
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It sucks that he had to die...or do you mena like that it wasnt what LucasArts intended?
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a criminal organiztion shouldn't have access to that much firepower.
So they should only have few freighters that are lightly armed and few dozen fighters? yeah really interesting game. And that's the point it's a GAME! of course they have to be able to stand against the other factions.
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a criminal organiztion shouldn't have access to that much firepower.
Why not? Black Sun, had a load of firepower, as did the smuggling, pirate, and mercenary groups. And, the Zann Consortium didnt have a huge fleet, it just seems that way in EAW (limited ships, planets, etc), they focused more on corruption.
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good point. the number of units is limited. the Empire had thousands of ISDs, on the game it is impossible to build them in large quantities.
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If you have the patience, you can in PR > : )
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FoC, like KotOR and the Jedi Knight series, is canon. Nothing anyone does actually goes against other stuff in the EU, which was something they actually did well (even if the end result was rediculous). In the campaign, they never actually destroy the Empire or Rebellion, they just get some information from the Eclipse and leave. If there are two things that I find to be complete bull in it is a criminal organization subjugating Mandolorians, and Tyber Zann beating Thrawn.
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Tyber didn't "beat" Thrawn!
A. Thrawn left the battle, so any battle mistakes were made by the man in charge of the remaining fleet.
B. Thrawn has bigger fish to fry.
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I have to agree the man before me. Thrawn left after he got the artifact. and that was all that mattered to him. But still Zann did remarkably well, too well. But I believe that if Thrawn had wanted he would have wiped the floor with Zann. and Zann subjugating Mandalorians was also stupid. but back to topic shall we.
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There was a reason I was allowing the FoC discussion. Ships from FoC were mentioned as being part of the Confederation fleet in Revelation
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Crusaders if I remember reading right. That should tell someone that FOC is canon.
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in the gcw, the mandos were very weak, and very few were practicing their culture, so they were weaker. however, it is ridiculous that zann did it in his rise to power. and even 1 manddo was dangerous. in the yv war, when they had recovered partially, they fared incredibly well against the vong in comparison to other planets which had a full-scale ground invasoin
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what ships in foc are used in revelation?
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I know they have to make the faction as powerful as the others for balancing purposes, but if they wanted soemthing that would actually conform WELL with the game, they should have made the Consortium rely much more on Corruption (bribing everything, stealing shit, etc). Because half the time in GC the Consortium player (and I am talking about M8ultiplayer)can own the Empire and Rebellion whilst only using a bit of corruption, a tad-piece. Their ships are a bit too over-powered for pirate vessels, and them dominating the Mandalorians is stupidity. Even though Thrawn retreated in that battle, the game tries to suggest that Tyber Zann is much smarter than him. Ehem, bullsh*t! That was what I meant by it not making sense earlier.
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I agree. Thats what I thought when I saw that. How could a hippie be as smart as Thrawn? (You cant tell me he doesnt look like a hippie.)
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he looks like that one british actor. the one who is Lucius Malfoy in Harry Potters and the british officer in Patriot. can't remeber his name right now. And I think Zann looks cool.
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He looks like a drug-worn hippie.
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i noticed he looked like jason isaacs too. he was based off him. is it me or does he have a disfiguring scar slashed across his face?
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As far as I can see he has a scar. I wonder where he got.
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a pretty disfiguring scar. not that it makes much difference. he was hit by every branch of the the ugly tree but one. he doesn't look like a vong. he's not that bad.
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some scars make you look badass.
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Yeah-I have two scars across my stomach from some kind of skin disease (not a major one-my stomach is normal except for those scars) that run across my entire stomach. People who have seen them think they look cool. And didnt Anakin have a scar on his face in ROTS? Im not sure, but I think he did-over his eye.
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i have a scar on my wrist from 3 consecutive surgeries, 1 in my abdomin from a knife fight (absolute truth!!!) and about 200 more that i dont want to list. i have had over 400 stitches in my life though.
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good for you. And yes Anakin has a scar which was given to him by Asajj Ventress. It looks cool if you ask me.
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yep right accross the eye.
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Yeah-that seems to accentuate his uber-coolness and evil-ness, if there be such a word, but then again, the concept is grasped so technically it is.
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i think it's more to do with jedi dark side teaching. pain leads to suffering. suffering leads to the dark side. the "pain was anakin having his eyebrow seared. the suffering was the pain from it. it brought him closer to the dark side.
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I don't think it has anything to do with that. it's just a scar.
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it's an interpretation.
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there is nothing to symbolize pain like a wicked scar.
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how about losing your hand?
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And his mother.
But we really have gone way off topic here..
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The question about is FOC canon is pointless. it is canon deal with it.
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Yep. A lot of it may be straining what is possible to the breaking point, but there is nothing I can think of off the top of my head that actually goes against anything. And the Zann Consortium never really gets all that big in the campaign (we don't have to consider GC canon). Tyber and Urai even acknowledge that there was no way they could possibly use the Eclipse with their numbers and size. The Sith army that Silri found can't really be all that big, either.
(Not that this does not mean that I like the Zann Consortium in any way beyond some of the ship designs)
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foc is from 3-4/5ABY, right?
wouldn't bossk be busy with other bounties? and ig-88 (i believe this one was B) was destroyed. that is canon conflict.
also, what consortium designs? they were all mandalorian, with the exception of the aggressor.
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I take FoC and other games as canon only until they conflict with well established canon
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foc is from 3-4/5ABY, right?
wouldn't bossk be busy with other bounties? and ig-88 (i believe this one was B) was destroyed. that is canon conflict.
also, what consortium designs? they were all mandalorian, with the exception of the aggressor.
Bounty Hunters usually have a lot going at a time. The IG-88 in FoC wasn't specified as being any particular IG-88 (probably A, seeing as it hacks the DS), though all of them WERE destroyed before Kuat. However, since nobody ever talks to him during or before that mission, I don't count it. And I said Consortium designs because they were used by the Consortium, and haven't been used anywhere else.
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i don't think major factions should be added to starwars history that is already written.
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By that logic, the Corporate Sector, Black Sun, Hapans, Empire of the Hand and Chiss shouldn't have been made.
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What about Yv? That Imperium thing. Killiks. The list goes on.
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They weren't inserted into a time where there was other stuff, so I don't think they mean those.
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As always, Im confused. ???
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By that logic, the Corporate Sector, Black Sun, Hapans, Empire of the Hand and Chiss shouldn't have been made.
thats true but none of them stick out quite as much as the consortium does. But since they don't interfere with anything than i guess i have to accept them as cannon :(
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i mean stuff that would severely alter the main storyline. (tyber zann taking over the galaxy)
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which he never does in-game...
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yea but he takes some major imperial planets.
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no he doesn't. he just corrupts them he doesn't really conguer so many of them.
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If you want to argue it that way, how many planets did the Rebel Alliance capture in EAW? Another canonical problem in EAW is when you send R2D2 and C3PO to Wayland (which was supposedly "lost" until the Thrawn Crisis in 9 ABY).
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yea foc was definatly a load of bull crap while fun to play but bull crap.
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You could Equally say that KOTOR is bull crap. there is no mention of Revan or the main characters before it that I know of. but still you seem to accept that very well. Just as there is no mention about Zann before FOC. same thing. so by that logic if you say Zann is fake so is Revan.
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Funny thing is that they had to start off the KotOR era with something, so doing it with a agme was probably a better decision than making it a book. At least KotOR is justified and doesnt conflict with anything and is fully canon, and people from that era that arent even mentioned in those games have appeared in the books. And btw, I am pretty sure that Revan would have been mentioned somewhere before the KotOR games, along with Nihilius, Kreia, the Jedi Exile, etc. And Meyer you obviously mis-interpreted what people have been saying. Dont jump to conclusions, and you cant just say that just because someone says Zann isnt real implies that Revan isnt real, because as I said, he doesnt conflict with anything, and also as before, he has probably been emntioned. Dont use logic in a false way, and not in a way that is malignantly idiotical.
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On the other hand, there is nothing to say that Zann hasnt been mentioned in other books, either under an alias, or as an unnamed underworld organisation.
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The thing is that the Star Wars "Canon" is always being expanded (and it can do that cause its fiction), you'd expect as a result that there are gonna be errors like the Consortium not being mention previously (not that I myself am a fan of ZC, but on the other hand I dont much like the YV either).
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and I also like to point that there is no mention of Karrde's group being the largest in Galaxy before HotE. And No there is no mention of Revan or any other KOTOR character before the games. And I just used your arguments of why Zann isn't real to claim that Revan isn't real. And that was only to point something. That you don't accept your idea when it's turned against you. And I don't see Zann conflicting with anything. Say one thing.
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the difference with KOTOR is that it takes place 4000 years before anything else in the star wars universe
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before kotor's release, there was nothing that happened in that time period. kotor created the era. foc did not create an era. it expanded an existing era.
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And until KOTOR was created, there was no reference to that era in any other canon source.
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and how does that make it more acceptable as canon than FOC?
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because it doesn't affect anything.
the zc gets a bit too involved. i mean, with zann being responsible for xizor's death, the IG-88 thing, and other stuff.
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zann is in no way responsible for xizor's death, and what ig-88 thing and what other stuff? And of course it affects. it would b stupid if it didn't really do or add anything. would you read a book in which nobody does anything that affects something? And it doesn't really affect very much to anything. say something it affects majorly.
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kotor as said before expands into a previously untouched era. zahn just affects pre recorded.
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zann is in no way responsible for xizor's death, and what ig-88 thing and what other stuff? And of course it affects. it would b stupid if it didn't really do or add anything. would you read a book in which nobody does anything that affects something? And it doesn't really affect very much to anything. say something it affects majorly.
zann framed xizor for stealing tibanna gas. vader used this as an excuse.
ig-88 thing- ig-88 is present post-endor, when all had been destroyed in oen form or another.
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kotor as said before expands into a previously untouched era. zahn just affects pre recorded.
But it makes no difference, fact is, both are games which created their own characters, which unless directly conflict with more reliable sources, are canon
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But the game conflicts with IG-88 being around at that point in time. The ZC was way to involved in warfare, and it took over the Eclipse, and destroyed an Executor-class Super Star Destroyer, which the game throws around like a dispensable puppet, which is of course false. What Executor was that? Werent only about 10-20 ever built? And is it mentioned that a band of extremely organised pirates attacked Kuat as the Imperial fleet retreated back there, and 'helped' the Rebllion forces obliterate them? Is it?
Perhaps the KotOR games did start off that era. Perhaps the characters there were never emntioned before it. But as I said, at least it does not conflict with anything. Btw I can accept my own ideas being turned against me. Doing wha you did was malevolently and intoxicatingly deceptional and cruel, and you attacked me just because I said something you didnt agree with. I think Scarecrow63 has also commented about that on a recently locked topic; it was locked mainly because everyone was off-topic, but I think also slightly because you were attacking people with no justification to do so. You are an arrogant arse that does not deserve to even post on these boards. Your points are invalid and sometimes stupid, and you have absoultely no reason to attack people, unless you yourself are insecure about how people prove you wrong, and hence you must resort to cruel acts to defy and demean them. I am in full agreement with Scarecrow63, even though in past we have dis-agreed soemtimes vehemently, but I am in full agreement with him now. Your stupidity has debased the people on these forums; are you proud you egotistical moron!?
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Who are you talking to?
ZC wasn't too involved in warfare. the campaigns only purpose is to gather information on how could you capture Eclipse. And no it isn't mentioned anywhere before that that ZC "helped" rebels in battle of Kuat. but it wasn't said anywhere that nobody helped them either. and there are 13 Executor-class SSDs. And Annihilator was one of them. So it doesn't conflict anything by being destroyed. And I guess you're soon to mention that in the game you kill Han Solo. And I say this once again: It's a gameplay thing. Sure there are some non-canon elements. but the mostly it is canon. just like your precious KOTOR.
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They were, actually. Not as much as the Rebllion or Empire certainly, but they were involved quite a bit. The Hypori factory raid, the Battle of Kuat (they destroyed an Executor, along with tons of ISD's and MCC's), the Battle with Thrawn, etc. THey had to do some fighting, otherwise they would have lost. They coud have wracked up all the credits the wanted to, but in the end, either the Empire or the Rebellion (or NR depending on the time frame) would have wiped them out. You cant just be a gigantic pirate organisation and expect to be left alone. The purpose of the campaign was also to get that artifact, and to pester Jabba, and you do a lot of fighting to get up to that point. Umm, they werent fighting the Rebellion at first were they? And they both attacked the Empire forces, so technically they were 'helping' each-other. Even if it isnt said or not-said, it happened. And that was the Annihilator? My I never would have guessed....I looked on Wookiepedia, and it said it was destroyed by Tyber Zann, but it did serve at Kuat. Apaprently there was no information on it apart from the fact that it served at Kuat, which is odd because it seems to be the only Executor Class Star Dreadnought without a history to it, which kinda leads me to think it was either invented for the game or they wiped it's early history to co-incede with the game. No I will not mention you kill Han Solo; I know he lived for a while after the NR came about. I know it's a gameplay thing and there are bound to be canon issues, but not some as major as they are in FoC. What is so bad about KotOR? There is nothing wrong with it; hell, I have never even played the bloody games! Except for two, but that was only for a little bit. Why would KotOR be precious to me? Sure my favorite Sith character is Darth Nihilius, but my favorite era isn't defined by one character. Your tone indicates you insult me and KotOR, and there is no need to insult an era because I profess to like it. Insult me, or dont insult at all.
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Wow, I missed stuff again.
Anyways, the amount of forces Zann wiped out on both sides should have hurt the Empire severely and nearly depleted the Rebellion's resources. Its a good game, and it gives the Eclipse a little background, but some of this affects the canon of Star Wars way too much. Why would they never mention a band of criminals who conquered several plants, blew up massive fleets of warships, and took over a mobile Death Star? You cant cover it up because entire worlds knew who Zann was.
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Still none of what you have said makes it any less canon than KOTOR. And How does KOTOR not affect anything? It comes up characters and things also never mentioned before. just like Zann. and it doesn't matter that it happens when it does. and it certainly doesn't start an new era. it's part of the same era with Exar Kun, Ulic Qel-Droma and all of those. and it also deals with an galactic scale war never heard of before. How do you explain that? because it's a game. they have things that may affect the known canon but the game itself and the characters and so on are canon. and about annihilator. there are dozens of other warships that appear on games that only give the name of the ship, and what it did on the game and whether it was destroyed or not. but you don't seem to think that is odd.
and aNaRcHiSt44, cool down. it seems you're taking this kinda personally.
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t doesnt conflict with anything 9KtOR) hence it is actually 'more' canon than FoC. What I emant by 'it started a new era' was that it basically was the first to actually focus on it and make information on it, hence the game technically 'started' the KotOR era. If you paid attention to the Star Wars Universe, which you apparently do, you would know that. I know warships are created in games for the purpose of furthering the game, but creating something as major as an Executor class Star Dradnought? I can handle say a few ISD's being made, but a Super Star Dreadnought? That just sets my teeth on edge. I probably am taking this personally, but then again, I am paranoid and devoid of mercy, and I am rather blunt and speak freely about what is on my mind. And right now that is anger. Not at you, but it is being unleashed on you. I apologize, but that's how I am. Sorry, if I have a go at you, dont hesiate to retaliate, because I probably deserve it.
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the first line is something I don't understand.
and there are other Executor-class SSDs that are just for games. Terror and some unnamed ship that was destroyed by rogue squadron at Fondor using STOLEN Tie fighters. but those doesn't seem to bother you.
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Sorry I meant to say "It doesnt conflict with anything (KotOR( I am talking about KotOR in this sentence)) hence it is actually 'more' canon than FoC." Sorry if you mis-understood; I type really fast, andI am bound to make some mistakes.
They dont bother me ebcause I havent heard of them, but now that I have; they do; enormously.
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it isn't more canon. they are equally canon.
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is it even possible to have more canon or less canon? they would all be equal wouldn't they?
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it isnt really that FOC is less cannon. its that it is harder to accept as cannon because it makes less sense. You can't really argue that anything to to with FOC is just unbelieveable.
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If they said FoC is canon, it is canon, just as much as KOTOR. Star Wars is their property, they can do what they want with it. I don't see the point of this thread anymore, there aren't any more points to make.
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Sorry I meant to say "It doesnt conflict with anything (KotOR( I am talking about KotOR in this sentence)) hence it is actually 'more' canon than FoC." Sorry if you mis-understood; I type really fast, andI am bound to make some mistakes.
They dont bother me ebcause I havent heard of them, but now that I have; they do; enormously.
What I meant earlier was that it is harder to judge it canon than FoC; look at what's around the word "more".
FoC is canon, but we dont have to like it, and it kind of stuffs around with a few things it shouldnt.
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we don't have to like anything that is canon. I person ally don't like LotF but I don't say it ain't canon.
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the first line is something I don't understand.
and there are other Executor-class SSDs that are just for games. Terror and some unnamed ship that was destroyed by rogue squadron at Fondor using STOLEN Tie fighters. but those doesn't seem to bother you.
stolen tie fighters exclusively featured in that game, but yeah, anarchist. don't go mad.
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besides the galactic conquest isn't cannon only the story line. those are ship names anyways names have been reused eversince ships were made. there have been to russian flagships named korolev
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Dont tell me not to go mad! I'll just get even madder! >:(
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I think we've had enough, locked