Better Infantry units for the New Republic

[Lord Xizer]

How are Turbo towers OPed?

[Corey]

They're already able to 1v1 an AT-AT and they usually come in pairs pretty close together, and there's usually 5 of them. If you put infantry in them that just makes it even worse.

[Lord Xizer]

They're already able to 1v1 an AT-AT and they usually come in pairs pretty close together, and there's usually 5 of them. If you put infantry in them that just makes it even worse.

Well Turbos were meant to deal with CAP Ships so it makes sense they'd be able to cut open an ATAT with relative ease. Also they are not good at dealing with infantry. I use Raptor troopers or Novas and can cut down Turbos with ease as long as there isn't a anti infantry turret to guard it.

(Also kudos, I'm a Grand Admiral!)

[Kalo]

The walls would have to be edited to be bigger and look as though they could have people contained within. Sort of like a medieval castle.

[JC123]

The walls would have to be edited to be bigger and look as though they could have people contained within. Sort of like a medieval castle.

So the walls are the same, tactically, as a ring of bunkers or sandbags except more visually impressive?

[Willhelm]

So the walls are the same, tactically, as a ring of bunkers or sandbags except more visually impressive?

is that not what walls are in reality?

[Corey]

My apartment is full of walls but I've never managed to sit inside of them and shoot at people.

[JC123]

My apartment is full of walls but I've never managed to sit inside of them and shoot at people.

Thats... a good point!

[Lord Xizer]

My apartment is full of walls but I've never managed to sit inside of them and shoot at people.

Have you actually tried?

[Revanchist]

All right, I've been watching this post, and I will thus give you my opinion. First, in the Thrawn trilogy, it is mentioned that Stormtroopers were very rare and not used often. Therefore, I suggest that the IR be given basic troops as the cheapest unit. Stormtroopers should be the most expensive infantry, due to the training required for them. They should have more health, have the take cover ability (they were trained to take cover in basic training, I'm sure) and should be given a thermal detonator ability, as each Stormtrooper carries one thermal det. It could have a long recharge time, and would be an area effect, as if each Stormtrooper threw his thermal det. This would help counter those pesky PLEX troopers, and give Stormtroopers more of the place they deserve: as elite infantry units. I also agree that the other factions should have a counter to the E-web trooper.

[JC123]

All right, I've been watching this post, and I will thus give you my opinion. First, in the Thrawn trilogy, it is mentioned that Stormtroopers were very rare and not used often. Therefore, I suggest that the IR be given basic troops as the cheapest unit. Stormtroopers should be the most expensive infantry, due to the training required for them. They should have more health, have the take cover ability (they were trained to take cover in basic training, I'm sure) and should be given a thermal detonator ability, as each Stormtrooper carries one thermal det. It could have a long recharge time, and would be an area effect, as if each Stormtrooper threw his thermal det. This would help counter those pesky PLEX troopers, and give Stormtroopers more of the place they deserve: as elite infantry units. I also agree that the other factions should have a counter to the E-web trooper.

If my stormtroopers start hitting everything that moves, I'm going to have to pick my jaw up off the floor.  I have to agree with you, though, all that training just doesn't seem to prove out like I want.  All the supplies, armor, training, and money should do something meaningful right?  Rebel troopers didn't have a 50% fatality course.

[Willhelm]

My apartment is full of walls but I've never managed to sit inside of them and shoot at people.

lol you know i didnt mean those kinda walls

All right, I've been watching this post, and I will thus give you my opinion. First, in the Thrawn trilogy, it is mentioned that Stormtroopers were very rare and not used often. Therefore, I suggest that the IR be given basic troops as the cheapest unit. Stormtroopers should be the most expensive infantry, due to the training required for them. They should have more health, have the take cover ability (they were trained to take cover in basic training, I'm sure) and should be given a thermal detonator ability, as each Stormtrooper carries one thermal det. It could have a long recharge time, and would be an area effect, as if each Stormtrooper threw his thermal det. This would help counter those pesky PLEX troopers, and give Stormtroopers more of the place they deserve: as elite infantry units. I also agree that the other factions should have a counter to the E-web trooper.

All I will say is nova commandos

[Revanchist]

If my stormtroopers start hitting everything that moves, I'm going to have to pick my jaw up off the floor.  I have to agree with you, though, all that training just doesn't seem to prove out like I want.  All the supplies, armor, training, and money should do something meaningful right?  Rebel troopers didn't have a 50% fatality course.

You see, that is where Lucas really messed everything up. Do you remember on ANH, when the Tantive IV was boarded? Remember how like six Stormtroopers were able to rush through the door they created and clear the ship of Rebels, all of whom were in positions of cover. Remember saying, wow those Stormtroopers are really cool? And then, each successive time they appear, they get dumber and dumber, until a band of primitives were able to wipe out an entire legion of the Emporers own elite troops. In my opinion, this battle was the worst thing to happen to Star Wars, even worse than Jar Jar. With Jar Jar, he was an idiot from the beginning. Stormtroopers, on the other hand, started as these elite soldiers (remember Obi Wan: And these blast points, too accurate to be Sandpeople. Only Imperial Stormtroopers could be so precise) and became the laughingstock of Star Wars. The same thing with TIE Fighters. And this is all because people like seeing the almighty good guys get off unscathed. Well wake up, idiots. This is war, and war is never fair, no one goes unscathed; the only people that survive are either the best, lucky, or cowards who never went to the front lines and got their hands dirty. Thank you for listening to my rant, and I'm sorry if I offended someone, but I am tired of seeing people that think Stormtroopers are anything but elite soldiers, the best of the Empire.

[Corey]

They may be the elite forces of the Empire, but that doesn't say anything for how they compare to the forces of any of the other factions. Making a dual-tiered infantry system like that in the mod would be pointless because there'd be no real way to make a difference without making the lower tier just not worth the credits, since infantry are already so cheap. The infantry we have in the mod are already those "Elite" forces for everyone. There's just no reason for us to waste time and resources trying to make an infantry level below the PA Enforcers, IR Stormtroopers, NR SpecForce and EotH Phalanx Troopers. Them being the "best of the Empire" doesn't mean they're better than SpecForce, doesn't mean they're better than the Phalanx soldiers, and doesn't mean they're better than the Enforcers.

The reason we're not giving them all the Thermal Det ability is because it /would/ be overpowered and it would mean infantry could beat everything. The reason we're not leaving the take cover ability on them is because we can't give it to the NR soldiers, which means there'd be a huge disparity there.

[ArcHeavyGunner]

Also
1.Problem(kinda)
IR has E-Webs, would be nice if other factions got equivalents

2.Suggest
Other factions get equivalents ie Flamethrowers, Light Repeater and Shotguns

3.Logistics
Make three(ish) new weapon models(which you said was possible) and new projectiles plus some coding/scripting stuff which I don't understand.

4.But is it Canon
Yeah, We know that there were flamethrowers, light repeaters, and shotguns in use by the Super powers at the time of the mod, so, yeah, it seems canon

5.Yes, it does(probably)

Here, new and improved(again), are my ideas. What do you think? (Is ANY of this possible?)(Please say yes)


Yes, this was posted earlier in the thread, but I feel like it is being over looked and is a good point. Sorry if I broke some rules, as I was never alerted to not being able to do this.

[Corey]

First off, you don't need to post everything in that format. I was posting the rough thought process you should put ideas through to make sure they make sense, like I said we don't sit there and map out those exact steps, you don't have to openly go through them like that. Also, I wrote like 3 paragraphs on this in my long post there, so it's hard to say it was getting overlooked.

As for the specifics, how are shotguns, light repeaters and flamethrowers the equivalents of an E-Web exactly? Especially a shogun, that seems like the exact opposite of what an E-Web is doing.

[ArcHeavyGunner]

First off, you don't need to post everything in that format. I was posting the rough thought process you should put ideas through to make sure they make sense, like I said we don't sit there and map out those exact steps, you don't have to openly go through them like that. Also, I wrote like 3 paragraphs on this in my long post there, so it's hard to say it was getting overlooked.

As for the specifics, how are shotguns, light repeaters and flamethrowers the equivalents of an E-Web exactly? Especially a shogun, that seems like the exact opposite of what an E-Web is doing.

Light Repeaters are a more portable, squad based variation of Mounted repeater(ie E-web). For a real life example, the E-Web is similar to the M2 Browning 50cal. Big, Heavy, not very portable but able to lay down massive amounts of firepower. The light repeaters are similar the the M249 SAW or the M60. Smaller, more portable, but able to put down less firepower but still more effective than the M2 on a squad level.

Flamethrowers are used in close combat as anti-infantry weapons (close meaning 50ish meters) to "burn out" the enemy infantry from bunkers and hard positions, like where E-webs and other heavy repeaters are stationed. Maybe the could do more damage to bunkers.

Shotguns are used in very close combat(10ish meters) and are very, very devastating. Also I didn't want to repeat myself and they are the only other anti infantry weapons I can think of, as snipers are already in the mod. If you or anyone else can think of a better alternative that would be great.
I hope this helps as I want this to be desperately implemented in the mod since my Special Forces idea got shot down in a fire ball of reasons.

[yutpaeksi]

Arc, I think you're misunderstanding the role and functionality of the E-web units. They're essentially movable anti-infantry turrets. That means they're primarily a defensive unit. This fits the IR war machine, a meticulous and somewhat slow powerhouse. It's not a unit that really fits in with the other armies' style.

Regardless of whether you agree or disagree with that, what you're proposing here for each side, wouldn't serve anywhere near the same purpose except for maybe the flamethrowers. A light repeater, like the SAW, would either end up being too much like the E-web (i.e. slow and including a deployment time) or it would be vastly overpowered for an infantry. The reason why is that all blaster bolts in the game are already very effective against infantry (you don't need to hit 4-5 times to kill each man). A unit running around with a crazy high rate of fire would be TOO effective against opposing infantry. That's why the E-webs have to be balanced by lack of mobility. For a mobile unit, you already have many anti-infantry vehicles already in the game. Now you could say that having infantry that can do that too is good for garrisoning in bunkers, but when in bunkers, regular infantry already fire seemingly nonstop coherent beams of light that wipe out approaching infantry.

A shotgunner, while an interesting idea, would also be very difficult in this game, and as you may or may not have noticed, doesn't really exist in the GFFA. The probable reason why is that blaster rifles already pack a lot of punch against other infantry. It's a LASER, it burns big holes THROUGH people. A shorter range weapon with more killing power would actually be a real disadvantage. They'd be slaughtered before they can close to range. You would have to buff them to be armored so that they can even get close enough. Even then, once they get close enough, what exactly would a laser shotgun DO that a blaster rifle or carbine can't? You could make it a more powerful weapon but in the game that wouldn't be any more useful against other infantry, it might help against vehicles, but that's what plex infantry is for, and they would have much better range. Now a flechette weapon is a better approximation, with an area-of-effect attack, something that can say kill an entire opposing infantry squad in a single blast. Then you'd have balance issues (see flamethrower below).

A flamethrower unit might be the only one that fits. But in the vanilla game, Boba Fett's flamethrower was a powerful area-of-effect wearpon and could slaughter infantry squads sent after one lone hero. If that was a regular mobile infantry weapon it would be overpowered. No other infantry would stand a chance if it was of equal range to a blaster rifle. Now you could make it a deployable infantry unit like the E-web, but I'm not so sure that makes sense and the EotH already has flame tanks. If you haven't noticed the TR team has done a great job of making the EotH a mobile, flexible fighting force (hence the lack of buildable turrets). A fixed defensive unit like that doesn't fit into that philosophy, whereas a Phalanx commando, a highly capable Chiss soldier trained to operate independently, fits much better.

I like these ideas, they're very fun combat ideas and while this sort of infantry-centric type combat would fit in say, Relic's Company of Heroes, it's tougher in a star wars game centered around crazy futuristic weaponry and vehicles. For Christ's sake, they have giant walking armored camels with fricking lasers on their heads!

[Revanchist]

They may be the elite forces of the Empire, but that doesn't say anything for how they compare to the forces of any of the other factions. Making a dual-tiered infantry system like that in the mod would be pointless because there'd be no real way to make a difference without making the lower tier just not worth the credits, since infantry are already so cheap. The infantry we have in the mod are already those "Elite" forces for everyone. There's just no reason for us to waste time and resources trying to make an infantry level below the PA Enforcers, IR Stormtroopers, NR SpecForce and EotH Phalanx Troopers. Them being the "best of the Empire" doesn't mean they're better than SpecForce, doesn't mean they're better than the Phalanx soldiers, and doesn't mean they're better than the Enforcers.

The reason we're not giving them all the Thermal Det ability is because it /would/ be overpowered and it would mean infantry could beat everything. The reason we're not leaving the take cover ability on them is because we can't give it to the NR soldiers, which means there'd be a huge disparity there.

Yeah, I know, it just rubs me the wrong way when everyone makes fun of them. I think that Stormtroopers should at least be stronger than Rebel soldiers, since they are more heavily armored after all.

[Enceladus]

Yeah, I know, it just rubs me the wrong way when everyone makes fun of them. I think that Stormtroopers should at least be stronger than Rebel soldiers, since they are more heavily armored after all.

That's definitely not happening.