Thrawn's Revenge

Mod & Network News => News, Dev Diaries & Announcements => Topic started by: Corey on February 10, 2018, 11:04:25 AM

Title: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Corey on February 10, 2018, 11:04:25 AM
In this update, we talk about  changes to one of the core features of Imperial Civil War, the era system. As usual, I have recorded a video version of the update for those who prefer that over reading.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1cpge8XvVw

For those unfamiliar with the previous versions of the mod, the era system was the system by which tech is determined in Imperial Civil War. There were 5 distinct eras, each with different rosters for the factions based on what the time period was- these were the Isard era, Thrawn era, Palpatine era, Daala era and Pellaeon era, and players would progress through the eras by killing the Imperial leader. The purpose of the system was to tie story and tech into each other. While this goal was accomplished to some extent, there were a few major issues this presented. First and foremost, while the Empire of the Hand and New Republic would always benefit from an era change, Imperial players were often unaware that while the number was getting higher, they did not necessarily benefit from era changes in the same way- it's not a direct tech system, so higher isn't always better. Secondly, while it was meant to be a narrative system, and it certainly added some depth for those who were familiar with the lore, it was not especially intuitive to players who were less familiar with this period in Star Wars. Finally for those Imperials who understood the limitations but still wanted to get to other eras, the only method available to them was to to try sacrifice their heroes directly. In 2.2, we're attempting to solve or at least mitigate all of these issues. We're adding a bit more depth and variation to era changes and the method by which they occur, adding more story to their occurrence, and even changing some of the circumstances for how they occur. In this post, we'll go over the new eras and changes, and how they can occur.

Some of you may remember that one of the first changes we announced for 2.2, before it took on the scope it has, was a "regicide" feature, where you can purchase an upgrade and it will progress to the next era as if the leader had died. We ultimately decided that this could be expanded a lot more to work better into the story. Each era now has three ways they can progress, generally- voluntary, involuntary, and timed. The timed events basically occur with events that were happening independent of factional choices within the lore, and put some pressure on the Imperial player to take advantage of their power points when they can, and also help keep the game progressing when not playing as the Remnant, but the timer tends to be quite long (it's unlikely to make it to era 5 through timers alone, except in the most drawn out campaigns). Generally, there is some advantage to being proactive with era changes over losing the hero or the timed events. These can all have different effects, depending on the leader, the map and the era. There tends to be more events within the eras, and we plan to expand on this in future versions as well, but this should give an idea of where we're going. Ingame, there will be holocron entry and leader speech events to help provide more background for each event.


(http://media.moddb.com/cache/images/mods/1/8/7376/thumb_620x2000/20180106160243_1.jpg)(http://media.moddb.com/cache/images/mods/1/8/7376/thumb_620x2000/20180106160215_1.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/gLXF6oP.png)
Era 1 Part 1
Imperial Leader: Sate Pestage (Economic hero)
Voluntary Progression: Isard proposes your help in Project Ambition, deposing Sate Pestage. This grants the Lusankya, along with extra heroes (ie Grand Admirals Makati and Takel, Ait Convarion).
Involuntary Progression: Either Sate Pestage is killed, or Coruscant is taken. Isard still takes over on Lusankya but with a smaller hero roster.
Timed: 60 weeks in, Isard completes Project Ambition on her own and takes over, but without extra heroes.

No matter which method is chosen here, if Abregado-Rae and Kalist are under Imperial control, Blitzer Harrsk will split off to form Zero Command

(https://i.imgur.com/0pWIDU8.png)
Era 1 Part 2
Imperial Leader: Director Ysanne Isard
Flagship: Lusankya
Voluntary Progression: Grand Admiral Thrawn offers his services, can be directly recruited.
Involuntary Progression: Lusankya is destroyed in battle.
Timed: 100 weeks after Isard takes over, Thrawn will complete his preparations and return to lead the fleet. Isard flees the Empire.

No extra positive or negative effects occur based on progression type currently

(https://i.imgur.com/SgC0k72.png)
Era 2
Imperial Leader: Grand Admiral Thrawn
Flagship: Chimaera
Voluntary Progression: Emperor Palpatine informs you of the massed Imperial fleets at Byss, orders resources to complete the Dark Empire forces. You enter era 3 directly.
Involuntary Progression: Thrawn dies in battle, and the Ciutric Hegemony splits off if under Imperial control. Era 3 still requires the Dark Empire upgrade to complete, or the timer.
Timed: 100 weeks after Thrawn takes over, Rukh assassinates Thrawn, with the same effects as Thrawn's death in combat.

(https://i.imgur.com/XEjarFD.png)
Era 3 Part 1
Imperial Leader: Reborn Emperor Palpatine
Flagship: Eclipse
Voluntary Progression: Carnor Jax informs you he's been poisoning the Emperor's clones, contributing to their degeneration. If you choose to help him, once Palpatine dies no Imperial territory will rebel.
Involuntary Progression: Palpatine dies in battle (on the Eclipse, or in a ground battle). Several Imperial planets potentially split off to rejoin Warlord factions
Timed: 100 weeks after Era 3 begins, Jax's assassination attempts are successful. Jax takes over, and several Imperial planets potentially split off to join Warlord factions.

(https://i.imgur.com/TgyfrH2.png)
Era 3 Part 2
Imperial Leader: Carnor Jax (Crimson Empire)
Voluntary Progression: Admiral Daala asks for your allegiance in her attempt to reunite Imperial forces. Imperial heroes from previous eras will remain if you join voluntarily.
Involuntary Progression: Carnor is killed in battle. Control switches to Daala, and all pre-existing Imperial heroes are removed.
Timed: Kir Kanos kills Carnor Jax. Daala emerges from the Maw and begins her campaigns against the New Republic. All previous Imperial heroes are removed.

(https://i.imgur.com/WWxt4C8.png)
Era 4
Imperial Leader: Admiral Natasi Daala
Flagship 1: Gorgon
Flagship 2: Knight Hammer
Voluntary Progression: Daala decides she is not the correct commander for the Empire, offers her resignation in favour of Pellaeon. Will return in era 5 with other Replacement Warlord forces.
Involuntary Progression: Daala dies in battle. Does not return as an era 5 hero.
Timed: 100 weeks after Daala takes over, she resigns. Pellaeon takes over.

(https://i.imgur.com/tg0eOSD.png)
Era 5
Imperial Leader:  Gilad Pellaeon
Flagship 1: Reaper
Flagship 2: Chimaera

Gilad Pellaeon is the final leader of the Empire

That's gonna do it for today. There are other era-based or time-based events in the mod, but this covers the actual method of progression. We're closing in very quickly on the beta phase, and so far we think we should be able to hit our target release date of March 28th for 2.2. Keep in mind though, it's still just an estimate.

Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: DarthRevansRevenge on February 10, 2018, 12:52:42 PM
i like it. very nicely thought out. and yeah, no, unless your in for a 500 week campaign, you won't get the full time.

i assume that the tech options for NR/EoTH won't be available till the leader dies/is removed, but while they have to research the units the heroes appear automatically?
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Lukii0141 on February 10, 2018, 02:21:46 PM
Sounds very interesting i like the idea that you have different options to change the era. Cant wait to play an era progressiv gc when 2.2 is fully released
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Labria on February 10, 2018, 04:17:44 PM
Good idea with time events, no more Palpatine and his OP superlaser forever if you play with Empire. ;D
Now we have "7" eras. Is it theoretically possible add more eras in furure or there is any limit for numbers of eras?
What ship will have Carnor Jax or he is just ground hero?
Will be Kir Kanos in mod?
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Illidan Stormrage on February 10, 2018, 04:21:15 PM
Maybe not in 2.2 but possibly in 2.3 could their be a way to extend how long we access to a certain Era by Idk.
1. Paying a high amount of credits
2. Completeing objectives.
3. conquering certain factions.


I like the timer because it makes it easier to deal with Palps, but it sort of raises the problem of where if Your Palps and control half the galaxy and then the timer is up you lose territory to Imperial Warlords.

Other than that all in all i really like this idea
two questions though:
Does Dalaa start with the Gorgon or the Knighthammer?
Does Carnor Jax have a flagship?
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Slornie on February 10, 2018, 04:56:04 PM
Now we have "7" eras. Is it theoretically possible add more eras in furure or there is any limit for numbers of eras?
The limit is still five proper eras because that's dependent on the tech level mechanic in the core game, the rest we're fudging via story events (hence it being era 1 part 1/2 and era 3 part 1/2).
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Schräge Musik on February 10, 2018, 05:22:17 PM
This system looks fantastic. Nicely integrates game mechanics into the lore.

Never really liked the tech level system; this overhaul is very important.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: feterox on February 11, 2018, 12:26:32 AM
I like that we are given the choice, but the timed feature seems to be stressful when you play as IR. You have to go after certain decisions to realize the full potential of the hero, i.e. getting SSDs out of a picture as Palpatine etc., on the other hand it could make the play more dynamic.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Schräge Musik on February 11, 2018, 01:58:52 AM
I'm also not sure about the timers. Might feel a bit strange sometimes, especially if you end up counting weeks to be keep track.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: kucsidave on February 11, 2018, 04:06:08 AM
This system looks fantastic. Nicely integrates game mechanics into the lore.

Never really liked the tech level system; this overhaul is very important.
Glad you like it, but one thing must be noted here. We don't integrate the game into the lore. First and foremost we want to make a game that is as balanced and fun to play as possible, and then try to get as much of the lore in it as possible.
I like that we are given the choice, but the timed feature seems to be stressful when you play as IR. You have to go after certain decisions to realize the full potential of the hero, i.e. getting SSDs out of a picture as Palpatine etc., on the other hand it could make the play more dynamic.
60 weeks is hardly what I would call stressful. It is a lot of time, during which once can confortably build up their forces. Not to mention that most GCs don'4 usually take 280 weeks, which is the time that once can reach Era 3 Part 2, so basicly about midgame.
I believe it will be more common for IR players to switch as they crammed out as much of their leader as they could and want to move onto the next one to milk it dry as well.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: feterox on February 11, 2018, 05:45:15 AM
There also stated "Flagship 1" and "Flagship 2", are we to choose one?
P.S. Don't have time to watch video in case it was elaborated there.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: taupin121 on February 11, 2018, 07:00:57 AM

The original system was already great but for sure less pleasant to play as IR, but with that one... that will be awesome !
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: t78 on February 11, 2018, 07:57:16 AM
This almost feels like Crusader Kings!

Regarding the Tsoss Beacon event... cut-scenes are of course impossible, but might the loss of heroes be explained by the picture from the Essential Guide to Warfare showing them being gassed, with text underneath describing that? Just thinking about the way the Total War series used to explain an event with a picture and some text.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Corey on February 11, 2018, 11:19:51 AM
Quote
i assume that the tech options for NR/EoTH won't be available till the leader dies/is removed, but while they have to research the units the heroes appear automatically?

NR tech works similarly to how it always has, however instead of unlocking all the units automatically some do require research.

Quote
Will be Kir Kanos in mod?
Yes

Quote
Now we have "7" eras. Is it theoretically possible add more eras in furure or there is any limit for numbers of eras?

As Slornie says, we're technically limited to 5 tech levels, but with some story and lua stuff, we can expand that as much as we want. There was some discussion as to whether we should call Pestage and Carnor separate eras directly and devising a new display method, but since they're more tied into their counterparts in their eras, they've been left.

Maybe not in 2.2 but possibly in 2.3 could their be a way to extend how long we access to a certain Era by Idk.
1. Paying a high amount of credits
2. Completeing objectives.
3. conquering certain factions.

Methods to extend the eras are being explored for 2.3, but wouldn't be something we'd be able to do in 2.2. As I touched on a bit in the news post, the 2.2 events are a starting point, from which we can more easily start branching out and expanding them in future versions, now that the basis is there.

Quote
What ship will have Carnor Jax or he is just ground hero?
two questions though:
Does Dalaa start with the Gorgon or the Knighthammer?
Does Carnor Jax have a flagship?
Quote
There also stated "Flagship 1" and "Flagship 2", are we to choose one?

Daala starts with the Gorgon, Knight Hammer will be event based. With how it's planned to be handled, sometimes you'd be able to get it almost immediately, other times it would be more of a process. Carnor is ground only. His flagship, Emperor's Revenge, has been left in command of Redd Wessel (ala Sysco and Jerec, but you don't need to buy it).

Quote
I like that we are given the choice, but the timed feature seems to be stressful when you play as IR.

For some perspective, the timer is 100 weeks and eras 1 and 3 last 200 weeks overall. Assuming all progression happened by timed events, you'd have to reach week 600 for Pellaeon to occur that way. I just completed Art of War in my playthrough as the PA in about 460 weeks. For most people, I don't know how often they'd even be encountering this unless they absolutely never use their leader units.

Quote
This almost feels like Crusader Kings!

I did play a fair bit of EUIV during 2.2, and that's certainly helped with framing some of the story-related stuff.

Quote
cut-scenes are of course impossible

They are? :angel:

Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Grand Admiral Jeff on February 11, 2018, 03:56:41 PM
Sounds good
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Recursion on February 11, 2018, 04:02:25 PM
gonna take some time to get used to it but looking forward to the changes
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Admiral Stephen on February 12, 2018, 10:32:09 AM
This looks like a very good change. I look forward to seeing it in action. I think it is well thought out, and gives the players some options on what they would like to do. The only suggestion I'd have would be to allow players to keep their current era if they choose, as others have suggested. I'm glad you're considering doing this for 2.3. But, this is definitely a great start!
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Corey on February 12, 2018, 04:24:23 PM
Very few people will ever even get to the point where the timed events even effect them. For some perspective, you are spending 100-200 weeks in each era with it. You wouldn't even be out of era 3 by time time I finished my PA playthrough.

More importantly, the option to perpetually stay in a given era was never a thing except for the Remnant, so why should the one faction that benefits from it most have all the power over when the game advances? If you're playing the Remnant and you're in a progressive era GC, there should be at least *some* impetus to take advantage of your power spikes while you can. We will likely eventually put in events that can be done to stop the timed events, but it will come at a cost to the Remnant.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Recursion on February 12, 2018, 04:38:12 PM
I assume era 4 will be the shortest of them all
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Admiral Stephen on February 12, 2018, 05:55:41 PM
Very few people will ever even get to the point where the timed events even effect them. For some perspective, you are spending 100-200 weeks in each era with it. You wouldn't even be out of era 3 by time time I finished my PA playthrough.

More importantly, the option to perpetually stay in a given era was never a thing except for the Remnant, so why should the one faction that benefits from it most have all the power over when the game advances? If you're playing the Remnant and you're in a progressive era GC, there should be at least *some* impetus to take advantage of your power spikes while you can. We will likely eventually put in events that can be done to stop the timed events, but it will come at a cost to the Remnant.

That's what I was hoping for. The player shouldn't be able to stay in an era at zero cost to themselves. I probably won't end up staying in the same era perpetually if I play as the Remnant, but I'm guessing there'd be some players that would like to.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: fireball900 on February 12, 2018, 09:29:30 PM
Personally I'm just glad I'm not stuck with Isard the entire GC. I've done a couple of IR GCs, and I found it very hard to lose Isard in a manner that wasn't complete stupidity - I was sending her alone against entire rebel fleets and winning. And while, yes - super star destroyer, it should be worth a fleet on its on... It was very irritating when I was constantly thinking 'DIE already, I want my Palpy's superweapons!"

They are? :angel:

Now that sounds promising!

Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: taupin121 on February 13, 2018, 02:55:59 AM
Personally I'm just glad I'm not stuck with Isard the entire GC. I've done a couple of IR GCs, and I found it very hard to lose Isard in a manner that wasn't complete stupidity - I was sending her alone against entire rebel fleets and winning. And while, yes - super star destroyer, it should be worth a fleet on its on... It was very irritating when I was constantly thinking 'DIE already, I want my Palpy's superweapons!"

I think SSD got nerfed for 2.2 so that will be easy to lose Isard.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Schräge Musik on February 13, 2018, 10:34:08 AM
I think SSD got nerfed for 2.2 so that will be easy to lose Isard.

That would be very helpful.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Jagen Eripsa on February 13, 2018, 10:57:07 AM
Can't wait to play with Pestage and discover the new transition system! :)
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: SAYMYNAME159 on February 13, 2018, 06:55:24 PM
This looks incredible! Love the choices and flexibility you're giving the Imperial player!
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: ErikModi on February 14, 2018, 05:14:19 AM
I'm. . . hesitant on this.  I liked the system that was shown earlier, the ability to basically pick one leader and play them for an entire GC, unless you messed up and got them killed.  While I appreciate the added depth here, being forced to lose a leader after a certain amount of time doesn't really sit well with me.  I kinda like to get to one of my favorite leaders, and then try and play them for the whole campaign.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: kucsidave on February 14, 2018, 07:31:21 AM
I'm. . . hesitant on this.  I liked the system that was shown earlier, the ability to basically pick one leader and play them for an entire GC, unless you messed up and got them killed.  While I appreciate the added depth here, being forced to lose a leader after a certain amount of time doesn't really sit well with me.  I kinda like to get to one of my favorite leaders, and then try and play them for the whole campaign.
Understandable, but if that leader is Palpatine, where the IR is the strongest in their progression, then One could just use this to stomp everyone.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: taupin121 on February 14, 2018, 08:21:07 AM

Will the AI research the "Voluntary Progression" ?
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: ErikModi on February 14, 2018, 04:15:30 PM
Understandable, but if that leader is Palpatine, where the IR is the strongest in their progression, then One could just use this to stomp everyone.

In single player games, is this a problem?
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Iregon on February 14, 2018, 05:55:12 PM
You may have mentioned this elsewhere, but I just missed it. Sorry if I did.

'Timed: Kir Kanos kills Carnor Jax. Daala emerges from the Maw and begins her campaigns against the New Republic. All previous Imperial heroes are removed.'

Is the time on this one 100 weeks as well? Or is it a different length of time? I am wondering because, since it is the second half of era 3, I could see it waiting for a shorter amount of time.

Also, how long does the Voluntary progression take to build/research, and will it be subject to heroes that reduce costs?
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Recursion on February 15, 2018, 01:05:52 PM
The era system need this change thank you
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Recursion on February 15, 2018, 01:07:32 PM
Will the AI research the "Voluntary Progression" ?

I'd imagine so
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: 0ffkilter on February 15, 2018, 06:45:23 PM
I'm. . . hesitant on this.  I liked the system that was shown earlier, the ability to basically pick one leader and play them for an entire GC, unless you messed up and got them killed.  While I appreciate the added depth here, being forced to lose a leader after a certain amount of time doesn't really sit well with me.  I kinda like to get to one of my favorite leaders, and then try and play them for the whole campaign.

I'd imagine there are multiple single era campaigns that will let you play with your leader; there are several era 3 and 4 campaigns already in 2.15 and I don't see them going away
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: ErikModi on February 15, 2018, 06:48:10 PM
Yes, but those tend to be fairly limited in scope, which is understandable for what they represent.  I like taking a single Imperial leader through as much of an era-progressive GC as a I can, and was actually VERY excited for the older idea of basically skipping straight to my preferred leader and playing them the whole way.  Adding a timer feels like a step backward.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: 0ffkilter on February 15, 2018, 07:29:14 PM
That does make sense, but depending on which leader you want 60 or 100 weeks is a long time.  In the video he made, Corey did say that it was mostly for other factions if you can't find the leader or he won't die. 
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Corey on February 15, 2018, 07:38:48 PM
It's 100 weeks per leader. Some eras have 2 leaders, so up to 200 weeks in a single era. Also, the size of some of the single-era GCs is comparable to Art of War in 2.15. If it turns out to actually be a problem we can change it, but it seems likle the people complaining about that particular change are ignoring the context of every other change to the mod. These GCs are era progressive, that's what they're designed around- it's not supposed to simply be a glorified in-game menu to choose which individual era you want to play in. That's why the era-specific GCs exist, and that's why we put in as much work as we did to make those a lot more expansive, too. This isn't just the old 2.1 setup of every GC, plus a timer.

Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: ErikModi on February 15, 2018, 07:45:59 PM
It's 100 weeks per leader. Some eras have 2 leaders, so up to 200 weeks in a single era.

True.  Though my favorite leaders (Thrawn and Daala, though not sure why since I hated the Jedi Academy Trilogy) aren't among those.

Also, the size of some of the single-era GCs is comparable to Art of War in 2.15.

Are the single-eras being expanded?  Sweet.

If it turns out to actually be a problem we can change it, but these GCs are era progressive, and what people are asking for the Remnant has never been an option for the other factions to begin with.

I'm not sure what you mean by this.  Do you mean that every faction except the IR has to advance in era in era-progressive GCs, because they have to kill the Imperial leader as the conquer or someone else does it for them?  The IR does, in older versions, have the option of winning the game just with Isard, since she's the starting leader and pretty hard to kill (what with the SSD and all), and that's arguably the easiest option since the IR is still at it's "height."
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Corey on February 15, 2018, 07:58:39 PM
Quote
Are the single-eras being expanded?  Sweet.

We've done a news post for each individual era over the last 2 years, covering what the GCs in those eras are.

Quote
I'm not sure what you mean by this.  Do you mean that every faction except the IR has to advance in era in era-progressive GCs, because they have to kill the Imperial leader as the conquer or someone else does it for them?  The IR does, in older versions, have the option of winning the game just with Isard, since she's the starting leader and pretty hard to kill (what with the SSD and all), and that's arguably the easiest option since the IR is still at it's "height."

That's sort of what I'm saying. The IR has always had toe power to get to whatever point they want, and stay there. Manual era changes increasdes that even more- they can get to when they're stronges (Era 3) or stay when the NR is the weakest (Era 1) and if they decided to keep that hero back, or if the AI were to hoard them, there's fuckall the NR or any other faction can do about it.

There are a few points to this:

Gameplay/Balance: The timer puts at least come pressure on the IR to take advantage of their power points, and stops them from being the sole determining factor in a system where they otherwise have all the power to determine their own decline/enemy growth.

Story: The regime changes are the backbone of the narrative in the GC, and from a lore perspective, the timed events tend to be the closest to how things "actually" happened- the player can simply choose to expedite those events.

Player Choice: This is the one that I think is causing some people to dislike the change, but I think people are looking at it the wrong way. If the basis of the complaint is that "I want to choose which era I'm playing in for the largest GCs and stay in it indefinitely" then saying there's no timer is, I think, the worst way to address that point. Because again, that option only exists for the Imperial Remnant and in no way solves the issue for anyone else, and still requires getting to that point in-game, which is a significant investment in time and resources.

So, if the point really is getting to choose which era you're playing in for large GCs, I think the better solution there is the most direct- we keep working to expand the roster of GCs in each era, which makes that choice be available for every faction, instead of, in my opinion, cheapening the era mechanic in the GCs that are supposed to be progressive as a story thing as opposed to just being a glorified menu system to pick an era in a larger GC so that one out of what is currently 8 and growing total playable factions can have that choice.

If we were to remove that potential drawback to those power points, it would have to come at either an extra cost/disadvantage for ther IR, or in a way that still pushes the other factions forward so it's not simply a method to win as easily as possible, which will take a lot more work to implement.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: ErikModi on February 15, 2018, 08:03:22 PM
That explains things very well, thank you.

Still not sure I like it, but I understand it.  But since I haven't played it, I'll withhold judgement for now.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: 0ffkilter on February 15, 2018, 10:19:56 PM
Yeah that does make sense, I guess the other factions still have very little power over what they can go to advance (esp NR in era 1) except for waiting it out.   I'm hoping for the best, and thank you for the explanation!
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Schräge Musik on February 16, 2018, 05:32:38 PM
Great explanation. Can't wait to try it myself.
Title: Re: [ICW 2.2] Era Progression Overhaul
Post by: Hairybum74 on February 16, 2018, 11:24:26 PM
As a decently long time person in playing the mod, it is absolutely great to finally see that the IR can actually progress without having to purposefully kill their leaders. It will make being the IR a lot more enjoyable and fun.